Life After Being Rejected by Literary Agents
Gut Check Time!
Resiliency? Check
Determination? Check.
Work ethic? Check.
Unwilling to accept the answer “no”? Check.
Will to succeed? How could I not?
These are all personality attributes that I’ve developed, nurtured, and harnessed in my leadership style as an Army officer. I figured that the publishing world was no different than the Army when it comes to how to become successful.
Talent is the other piece of the puzzle. As much as I loathe using this word to describe myself…..Check.
I may have lost the first battle, but I determined to come back stronger, smarter and with all guns firing. Down but not defeated—I went back to work.
I called independent editor Patrick Lobrutto the very same day agent XXXX recommended him to me. Pat is an independent editor but also a scout for Trident Media.
I described in great detail the journey of my manuscripts. Pat was confident we could fix the manuscript and get it right back in the hands of agent XXXX who would love it. He was oozing with confidence and got me pumped about editing the novel. I knew if I gave my book to him he could fix it. My two reservations with Pat were his set fee without looking at the manuscript and his list of past successes. He has many past successes, but they were mainly category fiction—crime, science fiction, and thriller. Though I wasn’t sure then how to categorize Paws on the Ground, I knew it wasn’t one of those.
As I was talking with editors, I began to edit the 126,000 world novel every morning before work. This was a bad call. I still had this idea that if I condensed the first half of the book to fix the pacing and threw in a prologue, it would be ready for re-submission quickly.
What I thought I learned at the James River Writers Conference was that saying something in fewer words is always a good thing. So I went through the first 250 pages of the book and hacked away. I was trimming with reckless abandon, though, and what I ended up cutting was in many cases the richness of the novel. That would come back to haunt me.
I next called Ed Stackler, another agent XXXX recommendation. I left a message on his answering machine.
Here is something I learned through this whole process: getting an audience with this level of editor is in itself a big deal. They don’t just take any Joe Schmoe with a book idea. Guys like this can pretty much pick and choose whom they want to work with.
I decided I wasn’t just going to put all my eggs in two baskets. It was then that I had an epiphany. If agent XXXX had guys he worked with, then other agents might as well. So I went to work scouring agency sites looking for recommended editors. Sorry, I can’t remember where I found my final two considerations for an editor, but it was from an agency site.
I sent an email to independent editors John Paine and Jennifer Fisher . John called me within a day to discuss the project. He was oozing with confidence, but he was more reserved, descriptive of his editing process, and his pricing was phased. He told me his job wasn’t to babysit or to do the work for me. He was there to guide me. When I hung up the phone with John I had the feeling he would make me a better writer. I instantly felt a connection to him.
I received an email from Jennifer. I liked what she had to say and she was well qualified, but I pushed her down the list because I already felt a more personal connection to Pat and John after our phone conversations.
Ed Stackler reviewed my novel and replied back that the book wasn’t for him. He was more of a plot-driven crime/thriller guy and by then I knew my novel is a character-driven book. He gave me some great advice though:
“……you can’t hold a reader by telling the characters’ life stories, starting in their teens, and moving forward slowly and chronologically. You can get away with it in a prologue, a conventional means of showing readers what came before the main story; but you lose the more commercially-minded readers (a/k/a many, if not most, lit. agents) by taking the tell-it-all approach. So – if my opinion counts for anything – more trimming and cutting won’t do the trick. Readers are going to want what you’re selling – the Afghanistan/military/dog story – almost from the beginning of the book.”
I knew Ed was right. I just needed to hear it from a guy with his expertise and experience. I began to come to terms with the fact that simple trimming wasn’t going to work. The idea that I needed to cut and then re-write the first part of the book began to become acceptable in my mind.
Another thing I learned about this level of editor is that they have connections with agents. This level of editor can get your novel in the hands of an agent. Of course there is no guarantee this will happen.
I continued to labor, but I felt relief instantly when I made the final decision. I was going with John Paine.
So I placed my John Hancock on a contract, sent it back to John along with the novel, and anxiously awaited his editorial report. I occupied my time with working on my new venture—this website.
What steps have you taken after being rejected by an agent?
What were the results?
Even though he had no connection to agent XXXX , do you think John was the right editor for me?
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24 comments on “Life After Being Rejected by Literary Agents”
Leave a Reply
Hi Kevin,
Sounds like you did the right thing–interviewing different parties and then using both your mind and your gut to make the decision. These editors would tell you if you didn’t have a chance. They don’t want to waste their time on something that is unlikely to get published traditionally. I agree that your persistence is likely to serve you well. Congratulations on this step–and let me know when I can buy the book. I know it will happen and it will be a better book for all you’ve done.
-
Kevin Hanrahan says:
Hi Lisa. I hope I did! Of course what I failed to mention is that my mentor…. Ginger Moran….. guided me every step of the way through this process.
At this point on the process I just knew I had something…. I just needed to find someone who could see it through a “lens” I simply don’t have.
Thanks Lisa…. I will be sure to keep everyone informed of the books progress….. I will tell you that the book underwent a transcendent edit. Which of course….in my normal way…. I will talk about the next time!
Steve Shaffer says: I’m not a writer but a rather avid reader (waiting eagerly for the finished product!). I do know that I and many readers get more hooked into novels/series that are character driven 1st, good plot 2nd rather than the other way around. We identify with the character. Plots are merely interesting at best by themselves without characters we can invest in. A great example to me in that category is David Weber (Sci Fi, often military oriented). He is a master of the lenghty novel too to no detriment to the telling, so don’t cut too much! BTW, dogs can definitely be characters we relate to! Don’t forget to keep one or two “tissue moments” as David calls them in the story. He usually has them about 80% into the book.
If you feel a connection with John and his credentials are otherwise good you probably made the right call.
-
Hi Steve. That is great to hear. My novel is character driven. I was afraid one of the other editors would try to change my book into a plot driven book. I didn’t want this. I am a people person and I like you are interested in the characters. This is the main reason I went with John Paine. He has experiences with all types of books and genre.
I promise you…..Paws on the Ground will make you cry…..it will also make your heart beat fast as you root for the characters…… I know it does to me when I read it.
Rick Sandoval says: Excellent learning lesson here. Continue to drive onward and follow what you know is right for you. I’ve had many clients whose goals are those of others and not themselves, thus leading to a life of “what if’s”. As a counselor it not only is my job, but my “duty” to help others seek what they desire or at least help them on the right track. I look forward to future installments. Since you have my son as one of your subjects, feel free to contact me for any missing material or encouragement.
-
Thanks Steve. I really appreciate your support. I have no doubt you were able to help Daniel in his challenging times. My wife is an LPC….what a great coincidence!
As agents seldom give you more than a form letter, you just never know where you’re missing the mark. I knew my genre was selling, but my senior citizen characters may be a bit before it’s time.
I had faith in my book and hired an editor, he helped me tremendously, but I decided to self publish which I feel was the best option for me. I’m getting good reviews and it’s the editor that really helped me bring my book from mediocre up to a notch I never thought it could be. I tell anyone that will listen that hiring an editor was the best experience of my life!
As for the future, I’m ready to start submitting again. Will I be successful, who knows.
Great post and good luck with your book.
-
That is great Madison. Congratulations on publishing your book! Hiring John was a huge step for me. But I will tell you that is was absolutely the right decisions. IN y next post in this series I will explain to everyone why I feel so strongly about this. Bottom line though- editors rock!
Best of luck with your submissions! Happy thought going your way!
I had my entire 3 book fantasy novel edited professionally but unfortunately she wasn’t affiliated with any publishing house or agents. I sent the book out to over fifty agents and then gave up and self-published–and I’m very glad I did despite low sales–I’ve only published Book I, The Moonstone, so far, but should have Book II out at mid to end of August–and–Book I only came out in February so I know it takes a long time…what I read and figured out was that even if an agent picks it up (which seems likely for your story) you will have to do much of the marketing yourself. But with your blog and so on I don’t think you’ll have a problem with that!
One other thing that stuck with me from reading Dean Wesley Smith’s blog was try to stay in creative versus critical voice when you’re editing…Good luck!
-
Hi Nikki. You bring up a great point. There are lots of great editors out there. But there are certain levels of editors……. I suspect there are also certain levels of agents as well. To get where I want to go I knew I needed a top flight editor. I decided to settle for nothing less. There is something about being vested in an industry that pulls a lot of weight with agents in editors. The four people I interviewed all had this weight. I also wanted my book to be the very best it could be….. I want to spread the word about what dog teams are doing for our troops. To do this I need mass appeal.
I’m so happy that your book was published and you are rocking the second one soon. I wish you nothing but the best with sales and getting it out there Nikki!
I think the most important part of this post is your realization that cutting isn’t always the answer because you eventually remove part of why your reader showed up in the first place. No one would’ve bought The Shining if King had cut it all the way down to: “There’s a psychic boy. His dad is an out of work playwright. They were the caretakers of a hotel in Colorado during the winter, and the hotel was evil. In the end, the dad went crazy and blew up the place, but the boy survived. The end.”
-
I think that cutting…..when you think you know what you are doing……but don’t….was my real problem Russ. I have been told that behind every successful writer is a talented editor. Hopefully I found mine.
Oh Kevin, you got me during a down period in my own writing “career.” So all your gut checks: checked. Get literary agent I work well with: check. Over a year and many of her efforts later: still no publisher. She is still confident; we will repackage the proposal for a different market.
Trip today to Barnes and Noble, including a quick check for the shelving of successful writers I am friends with: Susan Grant — no books shelved. Barbara Cameron — no books shelved. Anne Lamott (ok, I don’t know her but I want to) a few old novel titles under literature. Sebastian Junger (don’t know him either) — on the $5.98 Bargain table!!
So, in this free-for-all self-publishing open internet environment, are any readers out there willing to pay for good writing that is not pornographic (Fifty Shades of Gray) or the trend of the decade (Vampires)?
-
Hi Anne. I wish you the very best with you proposal repackaging. I am calling my agent this week to discuss my own proposal. I really have no clue about this next step/ I will be doing some research today!
I do think folks are willing to pay for good writing. I just think there are many different ways to find the writing nowadays.
-
Anne,
On the other paw, all the authors you mentioned each have quite a presence on Amazon.
I’m in the middle of subbing my MG novel right now, and I tell you what, I am SO ready to partner with a great editor. My background is in product development, and in that field you typically work in teams during parts of the creative process. More brains are better than one. I am ready for another brain to push me to the next level, hopefully someone who knows oodles and oodles more than I do about writing books. I can’t wait to hear how your work with the editor turns out. I’ve been tempted to hire an editor myself, but then again I’d like to go the traditional publishing route, so I’m hesitant.
-
Hi Melanie. Your last sentence really caught my attention….. I have been told that agents like when your novel is professionally edited prior to submission. It show a certain level of commitment to them. So I encourage you to take a leap of faith and find a good editor. I will always use an editor.
A wonderful post about the process. Since you are a people person as you describe the editor is invaluable to your career. Developing a long term relationship with an editor who knows your goals and pushes you is important as having one or two beta readers you trust in the first revision. I lost both my beta readers last year (one to a stroke and the other well I won’t describe) but it might be better not to have a beta reader who is related, that’s another story. Do you still think having an agent is key?
-
Hi Caroline. Thank you. I am really happy with my editor. I will post soon about what he came back to me with after his read through. It was amazing the to see things through his “goggles”.
I really need to find a couple beta readers. Do you pay yours? I have no idea how to go out and find some. Are they just friends?
I’m honestly not sure if having an agent is better than going Indie or not. Luckily I have an agent now so I can going that route.
I totally understand how serving in the military can be such an asset to keeping you determined and focused in a writing career. I served in the Army as well for eleven years and it’s given me a strong will not to give up. It’s great to hear about your own experiences since I’ve just begun my querying journey. The initial rejections have stung, but I’m learning from them. After the first batch I basically conducted an AAR. Now I’ve done a little more research and tweaked the query letter as well as parts of my MS (especially the intro).
My main character is a female veteran because I never see them in fiction and decided if no one else was going to do it, then I would. Sounds like you did something similar with your own work in finding a subject that hasn’t been done before. Though I put a paranormal twist on mine because that’s the genre I read.
Good luck with the editing. I’ll be checking back to see how it’s going for you! Sounds like it will be a great novel.
-
Thank you Susan. Military life….if you allow it to do so….disciplines you. Here is sit at 0430 preparing to knock out 800 words for my 2d novel before I leave for my 12 hour day. See….those after action reviews (AAR) you did in the military have a purpose. As a young Soldier I thought they were just chatter! LOL.
You character sounds great. That is a terrific idea to have a female veteran. You never see that! My book is the only one out there (that I know of) that is fiction and based in current day Afghanistan. It is the closest thing you will come to walking with a dog on point in Afghanistan.
I let everyone know what my editor said soon…. he was mind blowing. I thought we could make a couple tweaks and roll with it…..I was wrong.
-
Hi Susan,
While I can’t think of fiction with a female veteran off the top of my head there is plenty with female soldiers and officers, particularly in the Military Sci-Fi realm. If you haven’t checked out Baen, do so as they might be interested. Baen kind of specializes in sci-fi, fantasy and MIL versions of same.
Good luck
Steve
copperpeony says: As I posted in twitter, it’s a tough game. I never miss one of your tweets because they pull on the heartstrings. One of my favorite authors is Vince Flynn. He’s politically to the right and all his novels are about DC, corruption and the CIA. Great read if you’re into thrillers.
Anyways, his first novel was “self published”. Maybe he went through the angst and pains if editors and publishers/agents and was rejected but guess what? It landed on the NY Times best seller list and the rest is history. Every single novel has been a hit.
So don’t give up and good luck!! I know your book will be a best seller.
Copperpeony
-
I sure won’t give up…..I am not used to failure and won’t start now!
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Hi Kevin,
Sounds like you did the right thing–interviewing different parties and then using both your mind and your gut to make the decision. These editors would tell you if you didn’t have a chance. They don’t want to waste their time on something that is unlikely to get published traditionally. I agree that your persistence is likely to serve you well. Congratulations on this step–and let me know when I can buy the book. I know it will happen and it will be a better book for all you’ve done.
Hi Lisa. I hope I did! Of course what I failed to mention is that my mentor…. Ginger Moran….. guided me every step of the way through this process.
At this point on the process I just knew I had something…. I just needed to find someone who could see it through a “lens” I simply don’t have.
Thanks Lisa…. I will be sure to keep everyone informed of the books progress….. I will tell you that the book underwent a transcendent edit. Which of course….in my normal way…. I will talk about the next time!
I’m not a writer but a rather avid reader (waiting eagerly for the finished product!). I do know that I and many readers get more hooked into novels/series that are character driven 1st, good plot 2nd rather than the other way around. We identify with the character. Plots are merely interesting at best by themselves without characters we can invest in. A great example to me in that category is David Weber (Sci Fi, often military oriented). He is a master of the lenghty novel too to no detriment to the telling, so don’t cut too much! BTW, dogs can definitely be characters we relate to! Don’t forget to keep one or two “tissue moments” as David calls them in the story. He usually has them about 80% into the book.
If you feel a connection with John and his credentials are otherwise good you probably made the right call.
Hi Steve. That is great to hear. My novel is character driven. I was afraid one of the other editors would try to change my book into a plot driven book. I didn’t want this. I am a people person and I like you are interested in the characters. This is the main reason I went with John Paine. He has experiences with all types of books and genre.
I promise you…..Paws on the Ground will make you cry…..it will also make your heart beat fast as you root for the characters…… I know it does to me when I read it.
Excellent learning lesson here. Continue to drive onward and follow what you know is right for you. I’ve had many clients whose goals are those of others and not themselves, thus leading to a life of “what if’s”. As a counselor it not only is my job, but my “duty” to help others seek what they desire or at least help them on the right track. I look forward to future installments. Since you have my son as one of your subjects, feel free to contact me for any missing material or encouragement.
Thanks Steve. I really appreciate your support. I have no doubt you were able to help Daniel in his challenging times. My wife is an LPC….what a great coincidence!
As agents seldom give you more than a form letter, you just never know where you’re missing the mark. I knew my genre was selling, but my senior citizen characters may be a bit before it’s time.
I had faith in my book and hired an editor, he helped me tremendously, but I decided to self publish which I feel was the best option for me. I’m getting good reviews and it’s the editor that really helped me bring my book from mediocre up to a notch I never thought it could be. I tell anyone that will listen that hiring an editor was the best experience of my life!
As for the future, I’m ready to start submitting again. Will I be successful, who knows.
Great post and good luck with your book.
That is great Madison. Congratulations on publishing your book! Hiring John was a huge step for me. But I will tell you that is was absolutely the right decisions. IN y next post in this series I will explain to everyone why I feel so strongly about this. Bottom line though- editors rock!
Best of luck with your submissions! Happy thought going your way!
I had my entire 3 book fantasy novel edited professionally but unfortunately she wasn’t affiliated with any publishing house or agents. I sent the book out to over fifty agents and then gave up and self-published–and I’m very glad I did despite low sales–I’ve only published Book I, The Moonstone, so far, but should have Book II out at mid to end of August–and–Book I only came out in February so I know it takes a long time…what I read and figured out was that even if an agent picks it up (which seems likely for your story) you will have to do much of the marketing yourself. But with your blog and so on I don’t think you’ll have a problem with that!
One other thing that stuck with me from reading Dean Wesley Smith’s blog was try to stay in creative versus critical voice when you’re editing…Good luck!
Hi Nikki. You bring up a great point. There are lots of great editors out there. But there are certain levels of editors……. I suspect there are also certain levels of agents as well. To get where I want to go I knew I needed a top flight editor. I decided to settle for nothing less. There is something about being vested in an industry that pulls a lot of weight with agents in editors. The four people I interviewed all had this weight. I also wanted my book to be the very best it could be….. I want to spread the word about what dog teams are doing for our troops. To do this I need mass appeal.
I’m so happy that your book was published and you are rocking the second one soon. I wish you nothing but the best with sales and getting it out there Nikki!
I think the most important part of this post is your realization that cutting isn’t always the answer because you eventually remove part of why your reader showed up in the first place. No one would’ve bought The Shining if King had cut it all the way down to: “There’s a psychic boy. His dad is an out of work playwright. They were the caretakers of a hotel in Colorado during the winter, and the hotel was evil. In the end, the dad went crazy and blew up the place, but the boy survived. The end.”
I think that cutting…..when you think you know what you are doing……but don’t….was my real problem Russ. I have been told that behind every successful writer is a talented editor. Hopefully I found mine.
Oh Kevin, you got me during a down period in my own writing “career.” So all your gut checks: checked. Get literary agent I work well with: check. Over a year and many of her efforts later: still no publisher. She is still confident; we will repackage the proposal for a different market.
Trip today to Barnes and Noble, including a quick check for the shelving of successful writers I am friends with: Susan Grant — no books shelved. Barbara Cameron — no books shelved. Anne Lamott (ok, I don’t know her but I want to) a few old novel titles under literature. Sebastian Junger (don’t know him either) — on the $5.98 Bargain table!!
So, in this free-for-all self-publishing open internet environment, are any readers out there willing to pay for good writing that is not pornographic (Fifty Shades of Gray) or the trend of the decade (Vampires)?
Hi Anne. I wish you the very best with you proposal repackaging. I am calling my agent this week to discuss my own proposal. I really have no clue about this next step/ I will be doing some research today!
I do think folks are willing to pay for good writing. I just think there are many different ways to find the writing nowadays.
Anne,
On the other paw, all the authors you mentioned each have quite a presence on Amazon.
I’m in the middle of subbing my MG novel right now, and I tell you what, I am SO ready to partner with a great editor. My background is in product development, and in that field you typically work in teams during parts of the creative process. More brains are better than one. I am ready for another brain to push me to the next level, hopefully someone who knows oodles and oodles more than I do about writing books. I can’t wait to hear how your work with the editor turns out. I’ve been tempted to hire an editor myself, but then again I’d like to go the traditional publishing route, so I’m hesitant.
Hi Melanie. Your last sentence really caught my attention….. I have been told that agents like when your novel is professionally edited prior to submission. It show a certain level of commitment to them. So I encourage you to take a leap of faith and find a good editor. I will always use an editor.
A wonderful post about the process. Since you are a people person as you describe the editor is invaluable to your career. Developing a long term relationship with an editor who knows your goals and pushes you is important as having one or two beta readers you trust in the first revision. I lost both my beta readers last year (one to a stroke and the other well I won’t describe) but it might be better not to have a beta reader who is related, that’s another story. Do you still think having an agent is key?
Hi Caroline. Thank you. I am really happy with my editor. I will post soon about what he came back to me with after his read through. It was amazing the to see things through his “goggles”.
I really need to find a couple beta readers. Do you pay yours? I have no idea how to go out and find some. Are they just friends?
I’m honestly not sure if having an agent is better than going Indie or not. Luckily I have an agent now so I can going that route.
I totally understand how serving in the military can be such an asset to keeping you determined and focused in a writing career. I served in the Army as well for eleven years and it’s given me a strong will not to give up. It’s great to hear about your own experiences since I’ve just begun my querying journey. The initial rejections have stung, but I’m learning from them. After the first batch I basically conducted an AAR. Now I’ve done a little more research and tweaked the query letter as well as parts of my MS (especially the intro).
My main character is a female veteran because I never see them in fiction and decided if no one else was going to do it, then I would. Sounds like you did something similar with your own work in finding a subject that hasn’t been done before. Though I put a paranormal twist on mine because that’s the genre I read.
Good luck with the editing. I’ll be checking back to see how it’s going for you! Sounds like it will be a great novel.
Thank you Susan. Military life….if you allow it to do so….disciplines you. Here is sit at 0430 preparing to knock out 800 words for my 2d novel before I leave for my 12 hour day. See….those after action reviews (AAR) you did in the military have a purpose. As a young Soldier I thought they were just chatter! LOL.
You character sounds great. That is a terrific idea to have a female veteran. You never see that! My book is the only one out there (that I know of) that is fiction and based in current day Afghanistan. It is the closest thing you will come to walking with a dog on point in Afghanistan.
I let everyone know what my editor said soon…. he was mind blowing. I thought we could make a couple tweaks and roll with it…..I was wrong.
Hi Susan,
While I can’t think of fiction with a female veteran off the top of my head there is plenty with female soldiers and officers, particularly in the Military Sci-Fi realm. If you haven’t checked out Baen, do so as they might be interested. Baen kind of specializes in sci-fi, fantasy and MIL versions of same.
Good luck
Steve
As I posted in twitter, it’s a tough game. I never miss one of your tweets because they pull on the heartstrings. One of my favorite authors is Vince Flynn. He’s politically to the right and all his novels are about DC, corruption and the CIA. Great read if you’re into thrillers.
Anyways, his first novel was “self published”. Maybe he went through the angst and pains if editors and publishers/agents and was rejected but guess what? It landed on the NY Times best seller list and the rest is history. Every single novel has been a hit.
So don’t give up and good luck!! I know your book will be a best seller.
Copperpeony
I sure won’t give up…..I am not used to failure and won’t start now!